|
Post by Krall on Jan 17, 2017 19:17:57 GMT
|
|
|
Post by Krall on Jan 17, 2017 19:44:38 GMT
The original idea for my map came from a discussion I had on this forum about the plausibility of Native Americans developing gunpowder. My map was meant to show a number of states in the Andes who have developed a process of creating gunpowder from guano as well as making extensive use of different bronze alloys for tools, armour, weapons, and even basic cannons. I think Upvote interpreted the presence of gunpowder in the pre-Columbian Americas as evidence of outside contact, and made a map showing the colonisation of the Americas by Song dynasty China accordingly. As much as I liked my original concept, I love the weird alternate Cold War/ideological conflict that developed in the middle of the chain. I'm guessing "Harmonism" was meant to evoke an ideology influenced by Chinese philosophy, and was interpreted by Tonio as some sort of anti-ethic, anti-nationstate, regional unification movement? In any case, great maps everyone! I think Zalezsky has my vote for most beautiful map, but they're all good and this was a really interesting round of map telephone. Hopefully I can run another soon.
|
|
|
Post by rvbomally on Jan 17, 2017 19:49:55 GMT
Hey everybody, I decided to make an account here just so I could discuss this.
I have to say that the map series are coherent enough that, with a little tweaking, this could become a coherent world. I actually deliberately added the Cold War angle in order to encourage others to move away from the Americas and toward Europe or Asia, thus minimizing interference with what Arminius and myself had established in the Americas. I see that little trick worked.
I may do a unified world map of this, considering how well it worked.
|
|
|
Post by Krall on Jan 17, 2017 20:08:12 GMT
Hey everybody, I decided to make an account here just so I could discuss this. I have to say that the map series are coherent enough that, with a little tweaking, this could become a coherent world. I actually deliberately added the Cold War angle in order to encourage others to move away from the Americas and toward Europe or Asia, thus minimizing interference with what Arminius and myself had established in the Americas. I see that little trick worked. I may do a unified world map of this, considering how well it worked. Yeah, that happened with a previous map telephone game I was in - the maps ended up barely contradicting each other, and mostly making a coherent timeline. In this one I guess China industrialises early, colonises the Americas, then their empire falls apart and they stagnate for some time whilst Europe catches up and begins colonising the Americas from the other direction, and ultimately a "Western" ideology of division, states based on ethnicity, and competition conflicts with an "Eastern" one of multicuturalism, large powerful states, and the destruction or devaluation of ethnic and racial identity. Seems like the latter won, given Eurotropa's rise and persistence. Perhaps the North American Federation could be interpreted as a Harmonist state compromising Vinland, New Jersey, Kwanping, and possibly other former colonies?
|
|
|
Post by rvbomally on Jan 17, 2017 20:16:37 GMT
I was thinking the North American Federation (renamed the North Occidentian Federation) as a post-Cloaked War EU-style deal, with New Jersey as the black sheep that is starting to have second thoughts about adopting Harmonism.
|
|
|
Post by Krall on Jan 17, 2017 21:09:23 GMT
I was thinking the North American Federation (renamed the North Occidentian Federation) as a post-Cloaked War EU-style deal, with New Jersey as the black sheep that is starting to have second thoughts about adopting Harmonism. Ah, interesting. I do wonder what modern South America is like though - the maps rather quickly moved away from that area, though Upvote's did mention a country called "Guaparia", so maybe the Guapari Empire survives in some form? Also somehow it's taken me this long to realise that Jockehh's map has a united Sub-Saharan Africa. That's awesome.
|
|
|
Post by tonio103 on Jan 17, 2017 21:36:07 GMT
Wow, was really a cool adventure, a bit disappointed by the fact that Upvoteanthology/Becca almost overwrote your scenario. But the 'harmonist' Eurotropa and turkish Altaic russia as well as the Chinese america and a way less western world is still a very interesting thing that happened ^^ thanks for making me participate. rvbomally , your interprentations are really on point, loving them ^^ (and good job on your influence on me and the others), Eurotropa was designed to be a kind of more integrative European union puppeted by an exterior eastern power, i was thinking it was directly china, but seems like it should more be The Kwamping. @krall Yes, the Alkebu confederacy on mine was meant as that in the beggining ^^ I'm happy that Jocki thought about making it.
|
|
|
Post by rvbomally on Jan 17, 2017 22:23:51 GMT
Wow, was really a cool adventure, a bit disappointed by the fact that Upvoteanthology/Becca almost overwrote your scenario. But the 'harmonist' Eurotropa and turkish Altaic russia as well as the Chinese america and a way less western world is still a very interesting thing that happened ^^ thanks for making me participate. rvbomally , your interprentations are really on point, loving them ^^ (and good job on your influence on me and the others), Eurotropa was designed to be a kind of more integrative European union puppeted by an exterior eastern power, i was thinking it was directly china, but seems like it should more be The Kwamping. I'm trying to square your map with Jockehh's, particularly with what's going on in Europe. Any ideas on that?
|
|
|
Post by lordroel on Jan 18, 2017 4:46:28 GMT
You people have way to much free time and skills.
|
|
|
Post by MinnesotaNationalist on Jan 18, 2017 7:12:01 GMT
Definitely very interesting. I'd be very happy to join another such telephone game in the future!
|
|
|
Post by zalezsky on Jan 18, 2017 9:03:43 GMT
Loved this game, I have to ask though... TURKEY = RUSSIA?!?! Lol it caught me very off guard Great effort and work by everyone involved, let me know if there will be more rounds!
|
|
|
Post by tonio103 on Jan 18, 2017 9:12:46 GMT
Wow, was really a cool adventure, a bit disappointed by the fact that Upvoteanthology/Becca almost overwrote your scenario. But the 'harmonist' Eurotropa and turkish Altaic russia as well as the Chinese america and a way less western world is still a very interesting thing that happened ^^ thanks for making me participate. rvbomally , your interprentations are really on point, loving them ^^ (and good job on your influence on me and the others), Eurotropa was designed to be a kind of more integrative European union puppeted by an exterior eastern power, i was thinking it was directly china, but seems like it should more be The Kwamping. I'm trying to square your map with Jockehh's, particularly with what's going on in Europe. Any ideas on that? Hum, i think he got a bit out his mind, Europolis should probably stay the Eurotropa's capital. And he made the state bigger, not neccessarily bad, though i would have retained some of the smaller ones. He basically decided to create bigger states more coresponding to ethnicity. I'm not sure if it's on point with the scenario though, but it could be an abandon of Harmonism with a return to more nationalist states, not sure though. (I know Jockehh, and i must say he's a bit Lazy xD). I wouldn't take too much attention to the borders he made, it seems like he didn't really respect the border between Italy/Lombardy and Eurotropa, seems a bit strange that Lombardy and exchanged the alpine borgonyan territories with venetia. The most irrealistic thing is the take of Ticino, which has no basis in this TL, in OTL it's an artificial construct by the Swiss. Except if of course Lombary was conquered by the neapolitan republic then it may indicate that Lombardy was invaded and shared between Eurotropa and The neapolitan, becoming the italian republic. Such a thing should have created a state for Eurotropa in Padania though. Ohterwise, it's seems like Altai has fallen too, the Thessalonika pact has transformed into a union similar to Eurotropa, Britain Union or Iberian Union (maybe more the later ones than the former). Catalogne has joined the Iberian Federation. Syria succeeded somehow to make Armenia submit into a union as well. Do as you whish, but some Jocke changes, i would revert them back x) Nothing against him ofc. Altai falling is fine, The maghreb being independant, not necessarily but okay. The changes of borders inside Eurotropa and in Italy are a bit strange definitely.
|
|
|
Post by Krall on Jan 18, 2017 15:22:12 GMT
@krall Yes, the Alkebu confederacy on mine was meant as that in the beggining ^^ I'm happy that Jocki thought about making it. Ah, I see! I'd never heard of the term Alkebu/Alkebu-lan before now, so I had assumed that it was just an alternate Algeria. You people have way to much free time and skills. Guilty, on both counts. Loved this game, I have to ask though... TURKEY = RUSSIA?!?! Lol it caught me very off guard Great effort and work by everyone involved, let me know if there will be more rounds! I always interpreted the Turkey in OTL Russia more as a united Turkestan, consisting of numerous Turkish ethnicities, rather than a state populated by the same Turks that live in OTL's Turkey. It seems less outlandish that way. As for more rounds, I've already discussed this with Zalezsky a bit and I'm going to run another one, starting NOW! Zalezsky's kindly agreed to make the initial map (and is apparently over halfway finished with it already!), would anyone else be interested in joining?
|
|
Jocke
New Member
Posts: 39
|
Post by Jocke on Jan 18, 2017 15:56:57 GMT
@krall Yes, the Alkebu confederacy on mine was meant as that in the beggining ^^ I'm happy that Jocki thought about making it. Ah, I see! I'd never heard of the term Alkebu/Alkebu-lan before now, so I had assumed that it was just an alternate Algeria. You people have way to much free time and skills. Guilty, on both counts. Loved this game, I have to ask though... TURKEY = RUSSIA?!?! Lol it caught me very off guard Great effort and work by everyone involved, let me know if there will be more rounds! I always interpreted the Turkey in OTL Russia more as a united Turkestan, consisting of numerous Turkish ethnicities, rather than a state populated by the same Turks that live in OTL's Turkey. It seems less outlandish that way. As for more rounds, I've already discussed this with Zalezsky a bit and I'm going to run another one, starting NOW! Zalezsky's kindly agreed to make the initial map (and is apparently over halfway finished with it already!), would anyone else be interested in joining? I'd be happy to join
|
|
UpvoteBecca
New Member
Posts: 14
Pronouns: she/her/hers
Gender (Custom): Female
|
Post by UpvoteBecca on Jan 18, 2017 16:35:12 GMT
To Krall, sorry if it seemed like I was overwriting your scenario at all, it really wasn't my intention but I could see why it looks that way. I'd love to join the next telephone game, but move me more towards the end so I don't ruin anyone else's scenario! Also, I was hoping the Chinese government would be seen as a precursor. After the Chinese government fell, Guaparia would take over as the next dynasty, so to speak. Maybe it can survive as a very-slightly-Chinese-influenced native state?
|
|
|
Post by Krall on Jan 18, 2017 17:22:22 GMT
To Krall, sorry if it seemed like I was overwriting your scenario at all, it really wasn't my intention but I could see why it looks that way. I'd love to join the next telephone game, but move me more towards the end so I don't ruin anyone else's scenario! Don't be silly - overwriting someone else's idea/interpreting the same map in different ways is the whole point of the game! I was prepared for you to take my map in a completely different direction. I'll add you to the list of players for the new telephone game - do you really want to be towards the end? Because you didn't actually ruin anyone's scenario. Also, I was hoping the Chinese government would be seen as a precursor. After the Chinese government fell, Guaparia would take over as the next dynasty, so to speak. Maybe it can survive as a very-slightly-Chinese-influenced native state? Ah, I figured that was roughly what you were going for. In that case my map would presumably be set after both yours and Arminius' - following the collapse of Chinese authority in the Americas they're succeeded by the Empire of Azitediguo in the North and by the Guapari Empire/Guaparia in the south?
|
|
|
Post by Krall on Jan 18, 2017 18:08:15 GMT
I'd be happy to join Sorry, I missed your post. I'll add you to the list and send you links to Google Docs with both the rules and the list of players in them.
|
|
|
Post by MinnesotaNationalist on Jan 18, 2017 20:01:39 GMT
Signing up for the map game officially!
|
|
UpvoteBecca
New Member
Posts: 14
Pronouns: she/her/hers
Gender (Custom): Female
|
Post by UpvoteBecca on Jan 18, 2017 21:17:45 GMT
Don't be silly - overwriting someone else's idea/interpreting the same map in different ways is the whole point of the game! I was prepared for you to take my map in a completely different direction. I'll add you to the list of players for the new telephone game - do you really want to be towards the end? Because you didn't actually ruin anyone's scenario. Ah, I figured that was roughly what you were going for. In that case my map would presumably be set after both yours and Arminius' - following the collapse of Chinese authority in the Americas they're succeeded by the Empire of Azitediguo in the North and by the Guapari Empire/Guaparia in the south? Thanks. And heh, maybe not the VERY end, but somewhere in the middle if that's possible. I'd still like to build off of someone else's scenario while also allowing others to hopefully add off my own!
|
|
|
Post by Krall on Jan 18, 2017 22:12:03 GMT
Signing up for the map game officially! Ah, I forgot you expressed interest in joining in the next one. I've decided to cap the game at 10 players - which we now have, mainly on deviantArt - but I've gotten another request to participate already, so if I get a couple more I'll start another parallel game and include you in it. Thanks. And heh, maybe not the VERY end, but somewhere in the middle if that's possible. I'd still like to build off of someone else's scenario while also allowing others to hopefully add off my own! Alright, I'll put you in sixth place, so there's 5 players before you and 4 after.
|
|